that seems like a good set, if holding 1:28’s maybe go off 1:40’s as a target, see how you go
Friday was 45 x 100m off 1:45 holding 1:29-1:31
So drop that to 1:40, up the pace to 1:28 or both?
sorry meant 1:29, fat fingers…so keep pace, drop rest. see how it goes. Id then add a session maybe doing 1:20’s off 1:30 , perhaps 50’s to start if its too hard, then move up to 100’s 1:20s off 1:30
Don’t actually think I can swim that fast…
Think I managed 6 x 50m off 50s a few weeks back
that’s a typical triathlete thing, and probably where Id divert you to learning to sprint, like a sprinter. raise that ceiling which has more than just the obvious benefits of increasing all out speed.
I had the same question after my set today. I have my threshold pace set to 1:46 and I’m getting an IF of 1 or above 1 for my sessions that aren’t killing me. Maybe I rest too much or maybe 45 min sessions just aren’t long enough?
6x99m @1:33-1:41 off 2:00
- these were fairly hard, I had vo2max in mind but not as hard as I could go for 99m.
198m, 297m, 396m at 1:45,1:44,1:48 20s rest
- supposed to be threshold, these felt a fair effort but this is my 3800m PB pace
So, my speed session is doing the 33m off 45s as discussed around 1:29/100
If I’m aiming for 25minutes or 1:40/100 at the London Olympic, should this be my threshold or endurance paced sets?
that’s your TRP sets. train the body for the speed you wish to race. You do need a reason for that, ie a youth would want 1:10 / 100 to get points for the academy so we’d do sets at 1:10 / 100 off 1:20 (or 50’s etc. we’d do a stretch set 25m holding 15 off 30 , then reduce rest, slowly to 15 off 20 then 50’s holding 30 off 45 , then 30, off 40 etc. Its about finding where you want to be and working backwards.
endurance or aerobic sets will be much slower, think of them as the sets you will be able to really focus on what you are doing, that would be the 4k sets for example Hr will be a max of 40BBM (beats below max)
Thanks dude.
I’m sure that will please the others in the pool when I’m trying to race up and down 
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Okay, so 1:44-1:45 is about 40BBM for me, the 1:33-1:41 were more 30-34BBM
I can’t fit in 4K though! I can use 1:45 for endurance sets which would only be 5x400 or some other multiple maybe I could squeeze in 3x800.
I’ll keep the 1:29 for speed sets, TRP and see how far I can stretch that out to 100s and 200s tomorrow.
Thanks!
So using BBM more 10-20 and 40-50 less 30 (threshold)
I would be right in thinking this would then be done at what would likely be IM pace?
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Yes that is a good target.
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Sorry, 10-20 for what?
And I don’t understand “40-50 less 30”? 
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Sessions should be at 10-20BBM or 40-50BBM…do less work at 30BBM as a general rule. 30BBM is around threshold intensity and unless that’s specific race pace best avoided in the main
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If you want to hold 60min for ironman then options in my eyes:
(exact training paces slightly dependent on what your conversion from training pace to OW work out at based on quality of turns)
Some similar long aerobic sessions of 100s at 1:30 off 1:40.
Progress these away from 100s towards 10x400/8x500 hitting 6-6:15 off 6:30-7 turnaround.
Some harder sessions of say 50s-200s off a turnaround of your goal race pace. Likely only going to be able to hold <1000m of that in one go without recovery, say 6x100 hitting 1:25 off 1:30.
Agree with the super short sprints high rest for top end speed/technique and can be incorporated easily on easy days, especially for someone like you @funkster who is limited by top speed.
Can easily play around with them to make a session, other day I did 3x 7x50s 15-25-35-50-35-25-15m max with 50s off about 30-45s rest ish, or 100s building up to 100m MAX, or moving the fast 25s/50s around within a 100/200.
Even as endurance focused athletes I think we should be able to swim 100m 10s quicker than IM pace, similar to producing 1.5-2x FTP for 60s on bike.
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If you can hold that and not swimming <60 ironman than need to ask where the gap is:
-
conversion to open water speed, meaning need to be faster in pool for equivalent open water pace (or improve open water speed)
-
conversion to 4k straight, either because relying on having 15s rest each time, or only holding it for 100s at a time. That’s why I suggest testing over longer reps/shorter rest to see where it breaks down.
If you could hold 6 min 400s off 6:30/6:45 in the pool then suggests it’s the open water that’s the issue?
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Okay so I think I executed okay today.
132m IM
132m IM
Drill 132m Scull/FS
Main
14x33 off 0:40 @30s
6x66 off 1:20 @60s
3x99 off 2:00 @94s
—I just couldn’t keep this up any more so switched to
495m @1:54 HR 143
Don’t think 30s is enough for HR so those readings aren’t useful, the 99s were avg 151-156 max 159-161 which is 30BBM and I don’t think I can go any harder without all out sprinting.
This is assuming maxHR, not a swim specific maxHR right?
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Thanks both for your input.
I had my own ideas about why my race/OWS times were slower and you’ve both kind of confirmed it as well.
I can quite happily bang out 30-45 100s off 1:45 on a sub 60 min IM pace, but when the intervals start getting longer, I struggle to manage 10 x 200m off 3:30
I did a 1000m swim this morning trying to keep a steady even pace.
Tried to use the pace clock and check every 100
First 100 - 1:29 and felt really easy
Second 100 - 1:30 and reasonable
then keeping the same RPE the pace was dropping
managed to then hold it about 1:31 for the remainder
Came in at 15:14
As I’ve now got a 945, I can see my HR and there is some big old decoupling for the second 500m
Went onto some 50s off 50s, coming in at about 42s and could manage 6 before form started breaking down
So work moving forward looks like
- Longer intervals at pace
- Shorter intervals above pace
- Sprint work with long recoveries
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Losing form as you fatigue. You need to get TUF (technique under fatigue)
It’s why it’s a fine line in swimming as you need the long reps to get fit, but when form drops you are reinforcing bad habits.
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Hmm, I’m starting to think I go too hard in the IM swim then.
Mind you I barely kick on race day so my HR is probably lower for the same pace. So all good maybe.
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