You’ve never really been a fan of open discussion really have you?
Anyway, to halt the ad hominem nonsense and get back to the discussion (feel free to abstain):
@Adam
“ that Mpro who’s only ridden for a max of 2.5 hours shows you can get away with it but he must be coming from a massive base, engine and years of Ironman racing at the highest level.”
That’s probably true, but it could apply, relatively, to non-pros. Your (our, everyone on this thread) base may not be as long or deep as his to get a top 5 finish overall, but the training approach might still work for us to achieve our relative placing.
Yes. This was me at last years Outlaw. I think I would have had a comfortable sub 5:30 ride in me and could have run off a 3:30 3:40 marathon
I had loads of 2-3 hour rides on a road bike with club mates riding a high tempo with say the final quarter of the ride at threshold. Once my son was born in April I then spent a fair amount of time in the aero position riding sweetspot on the turbo (everyday for the 3 weeks I took as paternity)
I wouldn’t have been challenging for age group honours but still think I had a respectable time in me.
The weather obviously had other ideas and I cruised around In the swim and run in 1:10 and 3:41
This year I’m not chancing that especially with the hilly Wales profile. So as I said earlier definitely getting at least 4 long rides in. Otherwise I think you’re gonna get caught writing cheques you can’t pay
For me, a long ride was anything around 5hrs, and I got 5 of those in. With hindsight, pushing those out to 5hrs 20 consistently, may have been better and then cut right back on the shorter rides. Nearly all of these were on my tt bike, which I am very comfortable on and can stay aero the whole way. Where I was probably ligth was in brick runs and running in general. I got injured about a month out and stopped doing any running to let a niggly calf injury heal.
@joex getting back to your original question, what is a long ride?
For me, my weekly staple “long ride” is my saturday club ride of 80km, with around 1000m elevation, pretty consistent 2h25m-2h30m, its a real mix of social riding and max efforts - I think that this is a key to improving riding. Already done one extented 120km long ride in Jan. As the weather improves, I will try to do some extended Saturday rides. My fitness is now at a level where I can do a fast 80km ride in the morning and function perfectly normally for the rest of the day. When I first started, a longer ride (like 80km) would mean I was knackered for most of the day
Last year I only did 3 rides longer than 150km, and they were all events. I did 2 training rides which were over 120km. I think that before Lanza, I will do a couple of 180km rides (one will be in training camp), and the other I will take a half day on Friday in early April, and probably replicate Lanza elevation
Despite having older kids, I still get in trouble taking a whole Saturday to ride, the limit is around 5 hours, setting off at 7am and returning at 12pm (and I will get a load of grief for that)
I’ve not read everything above, seemed to get a bit tetchy
Coach Cox once wrote that a key differentiator between those that succeed at KQ and those that don’t was an addition of a mid week long ride. That was not based on an N+1 Slowtwitch observation but the statistical analysis he is known for.
Obviously if family commitments prevent you from doing them then that’s just how it is but it’s going to have an impact your IM result.
For me, I don’t have kids and I like cake ergo, lots of long rides
After the clocks change, and we have more daylight, I try to do a 90km mid week ride at least once per month - that makes a 125km day as I ride 35km to work in the morning, the long route home
That doesnt surprise me. If I look at my marathon plan for Malaga, that was exactly what I did with the running. Long runs on both Thursday and Sunday. It made a massive difference.
The question on the bike is how long is “long” in relation to midweek specifically. Once the clocks change, I can easily ride to work on a nicer bike and then do an extended commute home around Richmond Park and the like. I did that weekly before the Etape last year to supplement weekend riding
And with respect to the underlying question, I just don’t think lots of short rides would work quite as well. For some people, maybe, but not for me. If I do 90mins to 2hrs at a general aerobic intensity on the turbo I’d be absolutely fine. Extend that to 2.5hrs to 3hrs, and even silly low watts become hard. The muscular endurance part is crucial to me. There’s something about the adaptations that come from much longer riding, that makes much longer riding more sustainable.
If I do too much running, I get injured. (Touching wood) However, I seem to be able to ride pretty big mileage without injury. I have built up bike fitness and technique over 30 years.
Correlation does not equal causation. It referred to running specifically, but I am reminded of a coach who stated the successful runners are the ones who can cope with high volume training without getting injured. The Kenyan approach was to take a few thousand runners and thrash them to pieces. The few left standing are world beaters, the rest are trashed.
So of course the successful people do super high volume. But whether or not super high volume is best for you in particular is for you (and your coach) to work out.
And that is before you start talking about training v. work v. family balance and how much you would like to train.
Yeah, similar. I’d never ramp my running like I did with my biking when I got back off holiday. Poet made references to my ramp rates being suicide, but (touch wood) I’ve been fine. I’ve seen 10% FTP growth, and I’m now at a level where further ramp rates are going to significantly slow
This is an open discussion, and I’ve told you my view, which hasn’t included rubbishing anyone else’s opinion. I’ve agreed with various people here on this thread; don’t confuse not sugar coating an opinion with shutting down debate.
Tell us your goals, otherwise it will just be a series of strawman arguments.
Firstly since this thread was about long rides, I think your very unlikely to get injured from cycling, I am currently injured but can still knock out a 100 miler on the turbo as I did on Saturday, doesn’t impact the injury. In fact cycling helps clear the fluid on my knee, I am more or less swimming & cycling as normal without running and symptoms have got better. I cycle with a club, lots of guys there do big mileage week in week out and injury is just not part of scene. My triathlon friends however, I guess similar to the runners are probably 30% carrying some kind of injury.
In my case when I think back, my knee issue started in 2015 when my millage actually was quite low. As I said to Jordan who implied something similar, I think i was pre-disposed to this, my knee from the MRI is in good shape just this meniscus issue which is probably age-use related. I have actually had very few muscular injuries from training.
Of course If I didn’t do triathlon & played Playstation instead I’m sure I wouldn’t have had any problems but I don’t see how, before the event you can decide to only do max 13 mile runs and presume your preventing getting an injury?
I didn’t say that if you do 2 long rides per week you would KQ, just that statistically people that do KQ do big millage.
Not to muddy the water but I have the same view of marathon running. If you look at the P&D marathon plans there is a plan to peak at 50 mile/week, 70 mile & I think 90 mile. If you have the required adaptations to do 70 or 90 mile/week without injury your going to beet all the guys on the 50 mile plan, statistically. That is my view anyhow.
