Sub-3 Marathon Thread

@stenard @Tupperware

Some good news about returning from the US, all return rules are being scrapped from this Friday. I’ve nearly got everything booked now. Just need to look into this test I think the US want us to do about a day before, or find out how I can get the recently recovered from pass.

The transport secretary has confirmed that all remaining Covid travel measures will be scrapped.

Currently, everyone travelling to the UK must complete a passenger locator form before they arrive.

Travellers who are not fully vaccinated have to take a Covid test before departure, fill in the form, and book and pay for a PCR test after arriving.

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There’s no change if you’re vaccinated though right? The changes from Friday are just that even unvaccinated people have no restrictions either. Or at least so I thought.

Still need to figure out how to get the 1 day test valid for entry to the US. 1 day really gives limited wiggle room. The one advantage of traveling with work for the start of my trip is that I’m hoping they’ll pay for that one too!

Yes, I think the main change for us on return is that we don’t have to do the passenger locator form, I think that was mandatory regardless of vaccination status? That’s how I read it anyway?

The 1 day test is the odd one, especially as I’m stuck in Amsterdam for a night. Somebody told me you can get them on Amazon but not sure of the turnaround.

Have you had Covid in the last few months? If you can get proof that seems to mitigate the testing requirement.

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Ah, right. Yes, true. But that was a 5min jobbie from what I recall!

Still never had it according to the numerous tests I’ve done, including quite a few pcrs when feeling ill

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Hi :scream_cat:

A friend of mine has just run sub 3 at the Manx marathon and has a long term goal to do Ironman. She does swim occasionally and ride occasionally, I though this thread might be a good place to get advice on prepping as a sub 3 runner?

I promise not to darken this thread again :eyes:

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What’s her swimming like? Get her 400m time and see if she needs any coaching.

Cycling, that’s just about time on the bike.

Sub 3 marathon and she needs to be looking at sub 11 on a decent course.

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2:54 new marathon pb… 1 week after Salou. Guess i am in good shape

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Well done @Matthew_Spooner :facepunch:

I wasn’t sure how I would approach this race. I originally entered Zurich Marathon in 2020, which was moved to 2021, 2021 was also cancelled and became a virtual event and entry was defered to 2022. The problem was that I had raced Challenge Salou the previous week, and wasn’t sure how well I would recover.

I had 2 aims for Zurich Marathon, first was to get a GFA time for London… now that I have aged up to 50-54, GFA is 3:15, so I recon any time sub 3:05 is pretty likely. Second was to try for a sub 3 marathon… I have a 2:56, but that was a Zurich Virtual Marathon last year.

The week preceding Zurich, the weather was awful, sub zero temps, snow, sleet and wind. However, the forecast for race day was ideal, sunny, reasonably light wind, 3 degrees at 8am warming to 10 degrees by 11am.

On Sunday morning 6 friends met to catch the 7am train from Zug. Myself, Sam and Jerome all looking to do sub 3 hours, and Cecil looking for sub 2h40. Everything was very Swiss and fantastically well organised. We were all in Pen A with the faster runners, and arrived about 10 mins before our start at 0815. I had several layers of old clothes that I took off a few minutes before the race.

The gun went off and I crossed the line 45s later. The first couple of kms were busy, with lots of jostelling and trying to pass slower runners, but after 10mins or so, the road was clear and I was running with a couple of others. We settled into a really nice pace around 3:56-3:58/km My heart rate was around 160-165 and effort level felt really sustainable.

I used my usual Ironman fueling strategy of one gel every 4km, at this pace 100g carbs (400 cals) per hour, on top of this I was taking a cup of ISO at each aid station, approx every 5kms. This was a bit of an experiment as my HR would be higher in a Marathon than it would be in an IM, so wanted to see if I was still able to digest the amount of carbs - the text book would say that I was taking too much, but I have trained with high carb intake, so was confident that I would be OK.

On the run I went through 10km in 39:45, and felt like I was flying. The next section was 14km down the lake running into a light headwind. I was running with another guy who was looking to do a 2:53, soon we caught a group of 8 runners, and I recognised Nicola Spirigg. For the next hour we kept together, doing turns on the front, but staying in the draft as much as possible. Its really amazing how much difference the draft makes, RPE is significantly easier when in the pack then on the front. I crossed the half Marathon Distance in 1h23:45, not too shabby

At the Turn around point (km 24), Nicola Spirigg decided to up the pace, and our group split. I decided to go with the group of 4 faster runners, which was a bad choice, the pace was just a couple of seconds per km too fast, but I was burning matches to keep up. After a couple of kms I decided to ease off, but was now in no mans land, with no one to draft. By km 28 my pace had dropped to 4:15 - 4:20/km, this felt completely sustainable, and I would continue at this pace for the rest of the race. A few runners passed me, and I passed a few people who were begining to struggle. with 9km to go, my friend Sam passed me, and 4 km to go the group I ran with down the lake also passed me (I should have stuck with them I think). It was only in the last 2kms that it started to get painful, but being so close to the end, I continued running at 4:15/km

Garmin recorded my Marathon time as 2:53:25, but my official time was 2:54:55, I measured the course as 42.55kms

Nutrition strategy seems to work really well. After my Gel at km 20, I decided to take a gel every 4…5km rather than 4kms, and had my last on at km 38. I suffered no GI issues, and after run my stomach seemed to work fine.

It was a great day out. Cecil ran 2h39:37 to come 3rd in 50-54, I was 13th in 50-54, Sam and Jerome both got new PBs

Would be really interesting to know what I could run without racing a 70.3 the week before. I recon 2:48 would have been possible.

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So finally had a marathon that was put on to have a crack at sub 2:40.
Over here organisers panicked with the various lockdowns and cancelled the two marathons I had planned. But some of the fast guys wanted to run a fast marathon, so they endeavoured to put on a flat fast marathon
Entry criteria: sub 2:48 marathon, 100 people only.
Of course this being NZ there is probably not many more than 100 who can run that kind of time anyway, let alone who is ready to run a marathon. So they got 33 entries :slight_smile: Anyway, they added on a half as well and there ended up being 65 or so on the day.

It ended up being a great event, so grass roots, no medal, no irritating dj, not even a bag drop. Turn up run fast, go home…

It was a 4 lap course, first lap 6k, then 3 12k laps (+ whatever change was required). This was awesome as I knew quite a few running so lots of cheering etc.

However I have not had a good year, form slump, groin injury, covid, gastro, meant I only ran 1:19 at a half in mid April, so I had to double the distance for the same pace in 4 weeks of training, so I went for it with my biggest mileage block ever
180k, 179k, 170k, 156k, race week… That was it. Luckily i didnt break, for my 5k down to around 17 minutes so felt I had an outside chance.

Essentially 3 packs formed, the fast folk, a 2:30/1:15 pack, a 2:40/1:20 pack and then everyone else. Perfect right? But I didn’t feel great from the start and the 2:40 pack was more like a 2:38 pace and as I was already on the wrong side of comfortable I let it drift a bit.
By 12k I was not sure I would make it under 1:20 at half, but I did, in 1:19:30
So I kept going, thinking that when I start to really slip I will slow and run in for a sub 2:45, but I kept running 3:45-48’s and I knew I had 30 seconds to play with so I was still in the ball park bugger :slight_smile:

Anyway, in the end I couldn’t hold pace and came in 2:40:25, so close, but no cigar.

So, a big pb, great to get near given the build and with hindsight, I probably should have cut that 156k week a little as I think (and looking at my hr) I was just a bit fatigued :thinking: and was unable to up the effort when I needed to. Hence I probably should have manned up and hung on to the pack as there was a slight headwind on the out of the laps that was not helping. Anyways… excuses excuses…

The good news is that I am fairly confident with a better build, sub 2:40 is in there, it is just the case of finding the right course to run it and not getting injured.

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Well done, great performance even if you missed the arbitrary mark.

:flushed:

Can I ask how many hours those weeks were, and how did you split the time up?

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It is not that arbitrary as it the qualification time I needed to get back into the championship start at London…

Those weeks coincided with Easter and then another public holiday over here so it was slightly easier to go bigger than usual but roughly speaking in minutes…
Monday 90 or 120 minutes morning, 30 evening
Tuesday 60 morning inc 7k tempo, 5k race + faff evening
Wednesday 120 morning, 20-30 evening
Thursday 75 morning, including 6x1kish intervals, 20-30 evening
Friday 90 or 120
Saturday 120 with some hard stuff or a parkrun included
Sunday 120-165 minutes with hard stuff if hard stuff not done on Saturday (PR does not count as hard)

Most of the easy stuff was well run 5-5:30min/k

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Wow.

I love that your easy runs are actually easy. Shame you just missed out, but my PB list knows that feeling :frowning:

You see 3hr marathon runners doing “easy” runs at 4:50-55/km.

Nah, bruh. That ain’t easy.
(Same goes for cycling and “easy spin”…what, at 280W and 35kmh :joy:)

#EgoIsEvil :smiling_imp:

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Aahhhh so close! But that’s seriously impressive @ykk. You do a fair bit of easy cycling on top as well that I think helps with keeping the legs mobile and flushed.

Amazing to see thougj :clap:t4:

Great effort & really interesting to see you do your easy stuff at 5-5.30/km

Running twice per day always strikes me as the mark of someone who is pretty serious :+1:

When you run 90 mins before work, do you not feel tired later in the day? Think I’d be knacked by 11am

I guess I am guilty of going too fast on my easy runs. Out if interest, I just plotted my last 39 runs, I am surprised that I am trending slower, which is good. I think as I am adding more running volume, I am doing more easy runs.

Total 567km, time 48h35m, avg pace 5:09/km

I am pretty good at doing easy spins on the bike. Normally push hard on the climbs, but easy on the flats

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That’s a great time, I am sure you will get Sub 2h40m soon. My friend, Cecil Wheeler, who is 54 ran 2h39 in Zurich (he has the fastest HM time in Switzerland in his AG), however, he trained for 6 months exclusively to go sub 2:40, as a result, his cycling performance is pretty terrible at the moment. I think when you get down to these sort of times, unless you are a professional, it is difficult to maintain both running and cycling

I think @explorerJC ’s athlete just nipped under 2:40, whilst maintaining his swim and bike, on his quest for a sub9?

I recall a previous TT1.0 member (TvR - @pacha) running similar times back in 2015, he ended up doing a 9:16 at Roth.

Tom certainly runs around that time for a fresh mara and went 9:26 at Nice 2018 (3:06 mara & and KQ) but that bike course isn’t the fastest out there. He did 9:17 at Roth (ran 3:18) but would say his swim and run were much better by 2018 and would back him to have gone sub 9 at Roth had he done it in 2018.

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